Wednesday, January 18, 2017

The Two Witnesses are Key! Where Do the Two Witnesses Fit into Daniel 9:27?











My dear friends, no doubt that such a thought on this "established" topic is bound for harsh criticism by those who hold strongly to their Daniel 9:27 position... but... here we go.... My dear friends, the key to understanding Daniel 9:27 is found in the 1260 day ministry of the Two Witnesses, which takes place in the first half of the seven year tribulation (Rev. 11:1-13). Leave these Two out or diminish them at all and the whole prophetic text of Daniel 9:27 falls apart. Many fine biblical scholars throughout the years have suggested in this passage that it will be the anti-Messiah - who will make a covenant with the many (an abundance) - which also includes the nation of Israel and will bring shalom and security to the nation of Israel by adding his mighty strength (gabar) to it (Ezek. 38:8,11, 12, 14, 39:26, Dan. 9:27)

 The key to understanding Daniel 9:27 is found in the 1260 day ministry of the Two Witnesses, which takes place in the first half of the seven year tribulation. Leave them out or diminish them and the whole prophetic text of Daniel 9:27 falls apart.

In this text it never refers to Daniel's people or to the nation of Israel. It just points out that his covenant will be with an abundance of peoples (Dan. 9). These scholars have also believed that it will be through this covenant with the Anti- Messiah that the Jews in Israel will be able to rebuild a temple on the Temple Mount, which is at present one of the greatest holy sites in the Islamic world (Dan. 9:27). The Jews WILL indeed rebuild the temple at this time, but not in light of any treaty or covenant made with the anti-Messiah. It will be the Two Witnesses who will begin the re-institution of the daily scarifies and oblations, which will cease after their ministry for 1290 days because of Satan's Anti-Christ (Dan. 9:27, 12:11, Matt, 24:15, 2 Thess. 2:3-4, Rev. 11:1-2) and then begin again under the Messiah for a thousand years in the Kingdom Age (Ezek. 40-48); which will also point back to Messiah's perfect atoning work. These also through those sacrifices will begin to teach secular Israel their desperate need for repentance, propitiation and salvation dressed in sackcloth and that the returning King of Israel and Savior of the world is now at hand (Isa. 53, Dan. 2: 44-45, 7:13-14, 9:27, 12:11, Matt. 24:15, Mark 13:14, John 1:29, Rom. 10:2-4, 2 Thess. 2:4, 1 John 4:10, Rev. 11:1-2)! 

The Jews WILL indeed rebuild the temple at this time, but not in light of any treaty or covenant made with the anti-Messiah. It will be the Two Witnesses who will begin the re-institution of the daily scarifies and oblations...

Dear friends, I would like for you to hear me out on before you cast me aside as an apostate. Read this post in its entirety and looked at the Scripture references and see for yourself how absolutely crucial it is to NOT explain away or neglect the place of position that the Two Witnesses have in the first half of the seven year tribulation (Rev. 11).

In the Daniel 9:27 "covenant" it is suggested by many that the anti - Messiah will broker a "sound peace deal" on Israel's behalf and will be able to totally stop all Islamic and world aggressions against her. Many have taken great liberties on this Bible verse over the years, even to the point of leaving out or theorizing around the fact that the world at this time will be experiencing HORRIFIC EXPONENTIAL desolation via the Seal and Trumpet Judgments (Dan. 9:27, Matt. 24:4-8, Mark 13:5-8, Luke 21:8-11, Rev. 6-9).  These preach that the anti-Christ during this first half (3 1/2 years) of the tribulation will be fully able to override such EXPONENTIAL Divine judgments and still have power to protect Israel from all harm; even to the point that Israel's cites dwell without walls and in total safety (Ezek. 38:8,11, 12, 14, 39:26, Dan. 9:27).  My friends, such thoughts and theories now in the light of our EXPONENTIAL technological day with the world's GREAT weapons of mass destruction cannot hold any water. This Daniel 9:27 theory has been the standard template of many fine biblical scholars for a very long time.I totally believe the key to seeing Daniel 9:27 righty is found in rightly understanding the Two Witnesses earthly ministry which takes place in the first 1260 days of the seven year tribulation (Rev. 11:1-13). What is absolutely amazing to me is how little is stated about these Two MIGHTY Witnesses of Almighty God and their TOTAL AUTHORITY and POWER over ALL nations during the first half of the seven year tribulation (Rev. 11:3-13)

 These Two Witnesses are usually made light of and are mentioned secondary in light of the theory that the ant- Messiah will be the dominant player in the first half of the seven year tribulation period. This is a great flaw and a huge oversight with great consequences to sound prophetic truths that pertain to that Day.

These Two Witnesses are usually made light of and are mentioned secondary in light of the theory that the ant- Messiah will be the dominate player in the first half of the seven year tribulation period. This is a great flaw and a huge oversight with great consequences to sound prophetic truths that pertain to that Day (Rev. 6-11). It is my own personal opinion that when these Two are set aside and neglected as they often are, the whole prophetic perspective of Daniel 9:27 falls flat on its face. The anti-Christ WILL indeed make a covenant with many (an abundance) which will start the 70th week of Daniel, but I truly believe that it will be made against Israel and not for her. As we are at the end of the age we can see clearer than ever what others could not ever see. All of today's evidence shows that there is a united global effort and movement (including the USA) to use the EXPONENTIAL advances of human technology to subtly and stealthily go after Israel and annihilate her (Zech. 3:1-2, Eph. 2:1-2, 6:12). Even now Israel's back is against the wall on the world stage and without Almighty God's Divine interceding at "that moment in time" - after the Rapture of the body of Christ/Messiah - when the Daniel 9:27 covenant is strengthened by "the prince to come", Israel would indeed perish. It is my personal belief - based on sound Scripture evidence - that the Two Witnesses of Revelation will be sent to Israel as this covenant is confirmed and will then protect Israel for the first 1260 days of the seven year tribulation period (until the midst of the week) from all global satanic aggression and will preach repentance unto her (Ezek. 38: 38:8,11, 12, 14, 39:26 Rev. 11:3-13).

What is absolutely amazing to me is how little is stated about these Two MIGHTY Witnesses of Almighty God and their TOTAL AUTHORITY and POWER over ALL nations during the first half of the seven year tribulation.


My dear friends, a few more key points and challenges I would like to make to Bible scholars is for them to see how many times the person of the "Anti-Christ" is found in the first half of the seven year tribulation period in comparison to the second half. The passages referring to the anti- Christ in the second half of the seven year tribulation are much more abundant and display him in a place of total global dominance and authority, while in the first half he is lightly esteemed. The Anti Christ/Messiah does NOT come to ABSOLUTE TOTAL power UNTIL AFTER the 1260 day ministry of the Two Witnesses is completed, which will start the second half of the seven year tribulation period - (Rev. 11:3-7,13:1-5); thus he will be absolutely no match for Almighty God's Two Witnesses' ministry nor the dominant man of power as many make him to be during the first half of the seven year tribulation period. There are only a few places in which we find the Anti Christ in the first half of the seven year tribulation period and in all cases it is a place of secondary standing (Dan.9:26-27, Rev. 17:8, 10, 11, 2 Thess. 2:3, 6-8).
 

The Anti-Messiah does NOT come to ABSOLUTE TOTAL power UNTIL AFTER the 1260 day ministry of the Two Witnesses is completed which will start the second half of the seven year tribulation period.

The Two Witnesses of Almighty God - will be at this time GREAT BURNING lights of Divine REALITY and TRUTH unto Israel and the entire world (Rev. 11:3-6). In a post unregenerate church age world (Rev. 6-16) because of the Rapture of the Body of Christ - John 14:3, 1 Cor, 15:51-57, 1 Thess. 4:13-18, 2 Thess. 2:5-8, 1 John 3:1-4, Rev. 4:1), these Two will ABSOLUTELY DOMINATE the first half of the seven year tribulation period with ALL AUTHORITY, POWER, SIGNS and WONDERS (Rev. 11:3-6). In Revelation 11:3-6 we see the ABSOLUTE TREMENDOUS POWER that these Two Individuals can wield upon the godless nations of the world; including against Gog (the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal), the land of Magog and his confederacy (Ezek. 38-39). Whosoever opposes their Divine ministry for Israel and are for her total destruction will be immediately dealt with (Rev. 11:3-6). During their Divine ministry they will absolutely TORMENT the world for 1260 days and will be totally UNDEFEATABLE at this time (Rev. 11:3-10)! No wonder that after their 1260 days are fulfilled and then murdered at the hand of the beast that the satanically driven world will greatly rejoice with exceeding joy and give gifts to each other as they now proclaim in its right season (Rev. 11:7-13), "Who is like unto the beast? Who is able to make war with him (Rev. 11:7-10, 13:4)?" It will be this common bond of hatred towards Almighty God's Two Witnesses that will be the common tie that binds all nations against the established REALITY of Almighty God's RIGHTEOUS Person, His call to global repentance and the 666 alliance of desolation under the resuscitated Anti-Christ (Dan. 9:27, Matt. 24:15, Rev. 11:3-17, Rev. 13; Rev. 17:7-17).

These Two will ABSOLUTELY DOMINATE the first half of the seven year tribulation period with ALL AUTHORITY, POWER, SIGNS and WONDERS. In Revelation 11:3-6 we see the ABSOLUTE TREMENDOUS POWER that these two individuals can wield upon the godless nations of the world including against Gog (the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal) and his confederacy.

One more point I would like to write about and it is about is the nation of Israel during this time. The nation of Israel WILL dwell in total safety and unwalled villages during the 1260 day ministry of Almighty God's Two Witnesses unto the point that all manner of national security, technological and armed forces will not be needed (Ezek. 38:8,11, 12, 14, 39:26, Matt. 24:15-20, Mark 13:14-18, Luke 21:20-24, Rev. 11:3-6). Israel during this first half of the seven year tribulation will dwell in complete safety and in unwalled villages (Ezek. 38:8,11, 12, 14, 39:26) because of the Divine protection of Almighty God's Two Witnesses (Rev. 11:2-6). With the Two Witnesses of Revelation's POWERFUL Divine ministry, why would Israel ever need the Pre-Revelation 13 anti- Messiah of the Daniel 9:27 theory to bring them security, peace and safety? No human or even the devil himself can bring about that type of protection from the godless driven nations of the world as history has overwhelmingly proven. The Almighty ABSOLUTELY REIGNS in the affairs of fallen man and the devil must always submit to Almighty God's ETERNAL plan and purpose for all nations. At this time Almighty God's ETERNAL plan and good purpose will be to protect unbelieving Israel and seek her to repent to the saving knowledge of the Lamb of God via His Two Witnesses (Ex. 19:5, Job 1:6-12, Psalm 75:6-7, 103:19, Dan. 2:37, 4:17, 25, 32, 5:21, Zech. 3:2, Matt. 28:18-20, Rom. 13:1-5, 1 Peter 5:11, Rev. 4, Rev. 5, Rev. 6:1, 17:17). It will be during this time that Israeli hating nations, their possessions of GREAT weapons of mass destruction, their super abounding technological advances and Satan's 24/7/365 media machine cannot over ride nor tear down Almighty God's Divine hedge of protection for Israel while the Two Witnesses' ministry is reigning supreme (Rev. 11:3-6).

 It will be under the Divine protective hedge of Almighty God's Two Witnesses that Israel will thrive while the gentile nations and world are absolutely ravished by the Seal and Trumpet Judgments!

It will be under the Divine protective hedge of Almighty God's Two Witnesses that Israel will thrive (Ezek. 38:10-13) while the gentile nations and world are absolutely ravished by the Seal and Trumpet Judgments (Matt 24:4-8, Mark 13:5-8, Luke 21:8-11, Rev. 6-9). All these EXPONENTIAL evils upon the gentile nations in the first half of the seven year tribulation period are called the birth pangs by Jesus and he mentions to Israelis who dwell in TOTAL security at this time that they will "hear" of these horrific events but the end is not yet (Matt. 24:6, Mark 13:7, Luke 21:7)! However, what is most horrifically tragic at this time will be Israel's heart while under Almighty God's Divine protective hedge. Tragically the overwhelming majority of Jews WILL REJECT the Two Witnesses' (Moses and Elijah) Divine call to repentance unto Yeshua, the Lamb of God, Savior and Messiah, the King of Israel (Deut. 4:30, 31:29, Ezek. 39:26, Rev. 11:8, 12:17)

 The heart of Jerusalem at the end of the Two Witnesses' 1260 day ministry will be totally exposed and identified as rebellious, hard hearted, unrepentant and described as spiritual Sodom and Egypt.

The heart of Jerusalem at the end of the Two Witnesses' 1260 day ministry will be totally exposed and identified as rebellious, hard hearted, unrepentant and described as spiritual Sodom and Egypt (Rev. 11:8); now totally ready and ripe for Almighty God's Divine judgment and the prophetic fulfillment of Jacob's Trouble (Deut. 4:30, 31:29, Jer. 30:18, Ezek 39:26, Dan. 9:27, 11: 45, 12:1, 11, Zech 13:8-9, 14:1-2, Matt. 24:15-19, Mark 13:14-19, Luke 21:20-24, Rev. 12, Rev. 13).. The same Bible text also points out that this same city - when Almighty God sent His own people His dearly beloved Son, crucified Him and rejected Him; Who was their Messiah, Savior and King and - i.e. the ETERNAL Son of Almighty God (Isa. 52:13-15, 53, Matt. 21:33-45, 23:37-39, 27: 24-25, 27:1-54, Luke:13:33, John 1:10-12). Just with that perspective given by the Holy Spirit we can totally see that under the Two Witnesses' (i.e. God's Candlesticks) ministry that they will find GREAT hostility by Israeli leadership and the people of the land as the Messiah did who is the TRUE Light of the world when He came to Israel 2000 years ago (Matt. 12:39, 27:18-25, Acts 2:22-36). It will be at the end of the Two Witnesses 1260 day ministry that the unbelieving masses of Jews will side with the Beast and partake in his false victory over these Two Messengers (Rev. 11:7-13). He will be received as a great liberator but little does godless Israel know that Almighty God's protective hedge is now removed and like Samson of old (Judges 16:20) they are now open for Satan's Beast to decimate Israel and bring about the HORRIFIC time of Jacob's trouble spoken of by the prophets and the risen King of Israel (Deut. 4:30, 31:29, Jer. 30:18, Ezek 39:26, Dan. 9:27, 11: 45, 12:1, 11, Zech 13:8-9, 14:1-2, Matt. 24:15-19, Mark 13:14-19, Luke 21:20-24, Rev. 12, Rev. 13).

It will be after the death, resuscitation and ascension of the Two Witnesses of Almighty God that Almighty God's Divine hedge protecting Israel will be removed and GREAT HORRIFIC persecution (Demonic and human) will now take place against her.

It will be Israel's unrepentant heart and hostility against Almighty God's SUPER ABOUNDING mercy and grace (Ezek. 39:26, Matt. 22:1-13, 24:51, Luke 14:15-27, Rev. 11:8) that will then allow and open the HORRIFIC door of GREAT tribulation and Jacob's trouble (Jer. 30:18, Ezek 39:26, Dan. 9:27, 11: 45, 12:1, 11, Zech. 13:8-9, 14:1-2, Matt. 24:15-19, Mark 13:14-19, Luke 21:20-24, Rev. 12, Rev. 13).  It will be after the death, resuscitation and ascension of the Two Witnesses of Almighty God that Almighty God's Divine hedge protecting Israel will be removed and GREAT HORRIFIC persecution (Demonic and human) will now take place against her (Jer. 30:1-8, Dan. 12:1, Zech. 13:8-9, 14:-2, Matt. 24:15-22, Mark 13:14-20, Luke 21:20-24, Rev. 12:12-17).

The resuscitation and ascension of Almighty God's Two Witnesses before a globally ravished - gleeful, demonically driven, godless world and Israel (Rev. 11:7-12) will validate without a shadow of doubt ALL of their Divine words of TRUTH from their 1260 day ministry and ETERNALLY confirm that indeed, "The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall REIGN for EVER and EVER - Rev. 11:15"! All of the Two Witnesses Words have now been absolutely validated and WILL come to pass and no godless world, the beast or Satan himself can and will EVER stop Messiah's coming reign and their ETERNAL demise (2 Thess. 2:8-12, Rev. 14:9-11, Rev. 19:11-21)!

 The resuscitation and ascension of Almighty God's Two Witnesses before a ravished - gleeful, demonically driven, godless world and Israel will validate without a shadow of doubt ALL of their Divine words of TRUTH of their 1260 day ministry and ETERNALLY confirm that indeed, "The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall REIGN for EVER and EVER!"

It will be NOW during this last EXPONENTIALLY HORRIFIC "time, times and half a time/forty two months/1260 days (Dan.12:7, Rev. 12:14, Rev. 13:5) that Satan, his beast and the nations of the world will seek the absolute eradication of Israel, but most specifically the remnant of Israel and gentile converts who have received the Messiah under the Two Witnesses ministry (Jer. 30:4-8, Dan. 12:1,7, Zech. 13:8-9, 14:1-2, Matt. 24:15-22, Rev. 7, Rev. 14, Rev. 12:5-17). Israel, because of their FULL rejection of the POWERFUL ministry of Israel's Moses and Elijah (Almighty God's Two Witnesses) will be now given over to GREAT TRIBULATION and to their reprobate mind (Deut. 4:30, Jer. 30:4-7, Ezek. 39:26, Dan. 9:27, 12:1, Rom. 1:18-32, Rev. 11:2, 8)!

Israel, because of their FULL rejection of the POWERFUL ministry of Israel's Moses and Elijah (Almighty God's Two Witnesses) will be now given over to GREAT TRIBULATION and to their reprobate mind.

During this post Two Witness world, the forty two month Satanic global reign of terror against Israel and the redeemed of the nations will be HORRIFIC (Jer. 30:4-7, Zech. 14:1-2, Matt. 24:9-22, Rev. 11:2, 12:13-17)! These forty two months will seem like decades as Israelis seek to survive this HORRIFIC global purge. For those who were able to flee to the wilderness, they will be SUPER NATURALLY protected and nourished for this time (Rev. 12:14). It will be during this time of Divine protection (Rev. 12:13-17) that those who are Israel's remnant at this place of protection will be nourished in the TRUTHS they have heard from the Two Witnesses of Almighty God and consider their words and ministry. However it will not be until those who are left of the nation Israel see the second Coming of the Messiah from Heaven's glory that they will NOW truly comprehend ALL the words of Almighty God's Two Witnesses and then with GREAT contrition, repentance and weeping receive Him as their Lamb, Savior and King (Isa. 45:17, 59:20, Jer. 30:4-8, 31:33, Dan. 2:43-44, 7:13-1, Joel 2:32, Zech. 12:10-14, 13:8-9, Mal. 4:4-6, Matt. 17:11, 23:39, 26:63-64, Mark 9:12, 14:62, Rom. 11:26, Rev. 1:7, 19:11-21).

It will be these Two Witnesses who arrive after the Rapture of the Body of Christ who will be used greatly by the ETERNAL Holy Spirit of Almighty God to tell an EXPONENTIAL technological, lawless world that the Day of the Lord is now here and the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand!

My dear friends in conclusion we have tried to point out through many Bible verses that the Two Witnesses (who are Moses and Elijah) are absolute crucial in understanding end time prophecy. Leave these Two out and many prophetic theories will collapse including Daniel 9:27. The seven year tribulation is all about Almighty God dealing with Israel (Dan. 9) and restoring that nation to their Divine purpose and covenant promises Almighty God made with their Fathers (Abraham, Isaac and Jacob/Israel). It will be these Two Witnesses who arrive after the Rapture of the Body of Christ, that will be used greatly by the ETERNAL Holy Spirit of Almighty God to tell an EXPONENTIAL godless, technological and lawless world that the Day of the Lord is now here and the Kingdom of Heaven is indeed at hand!   (Zech. 4:1-6, John 16:8-12, Rev. 11:4)


The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand!

DJP I.F.


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35 comments:

Anonymous said...

Praise the Lord!!! What an excellent article. It fits. Fills in some of the lingering questions and answers about that time period. Brother, You did well. I have for many months thought about the Jewish people in Jerusalem looking over the Temple Mount and seeing the Super Blood Red Moon on Sukkoth. So perhaps on Sept 15th 2015 the shofar will blow the Tekiah Gedolah, and the Lord Jesus Christ will Shout, and the Catching Away of the Body of Christ will take place, and the Two Witnesses will appear on or around Jubilee!!!! Keep Looking Up, James

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

James, thanks for your reply!

Even so come Yeshua!
Eph. 3:20!
David

Anonymous said...

David, I'm curious about your thoughts on the two witnesses being Moses and Elijah. I've heard from several different prophecy teachers that these two would most likely be Enoch and Elijah since scripture tells us they were both taken to heaven alive without dying in their earthly bodies. They reference the verse "it is appointed to man to die once, then after this the judgment" as being fulfilled for them when anti-christ kills them publicly. Anyway, we know that Moses did die and God himself buried him on Mt. Nebo. So, how would he be one of the two witnesses since he would have to die all over again? Just wondering your thoughts. Be blessed.
Barry

Elizabeth Hawkes said...

Eagerly awaiting the day of rapture. Even so, come quickly Lord Jesus.

Anonymous said...

The passage in Daniel 9 DOES deal directly with "God's people." This is Daniel's prayer of intercession and confession for his people, the Jews. In verse 9:24, the words "thy people" and "thy holy city" are used. The people are clearly the Jews and the city is clearly Jerusalem.

The anti-Messiah will be the one who confirms the covenant with Israel. Not all the leaders of Israel will be in agreement with this covenant but "many" will. The anti-Messiah will not be fully recognized at this point in time although some may know. It is when he exalts himself as god that is the true revelation.

The protection of Israel, of course, is not due to the two witnesses. They will be God's instruments of protection for Israel. When the two witnesses are resurrected, Israel will know that those two witnesses were proclaiming the Truth. Once they know the Truth, the anti-Messiah goes on a rampage to kill all Jews.

The mystery of the identity of the two witnesses will continue. However, it is not Scriptural that one with a translated body would once again live upon the earth prior to the millennium. II Kings 2:1 says that "Elijah was taken up into heaven" indicating that he was translated. Hebrews 11:5 also confirms this.

Yes, the miracles that the two witnesses perform are similar to the Old Testament prophets but it is only speculation. God may choose two unknowns to be His "candlesticks," Zechariah 4:11-14.

Your article has some good points but, as mentioned, there are some deviations from Scripture.

Anonymous said...

It is all about God's people. Dan 9:24 is laying out time and events for his people and his holy city. Dan 9:27 speaks of a specific event saying "a covenant with many". Where is Israel mentioned in this?
I think this "covenant with many" is a result of the Psalm 83 confederacy of Arab nations losing badly to Israel after attacking them. An agreement of the nations with the Anti-Christ to stop so that Israel does not continue to advance. Even this agreement with the Anti-Christ would not work without the miraculous punishment of the Two Witnesses (calling down fire and drought etc.) Think of those who would never quit attacking Israel; fanatics, Lone wolfs, splinter groups.
This results in the Ezek 38:11&12 Israel dwelling in unwalled villages in safety in the midst of the land. And they dwell that way with the two witnesses miraculously protecting them. This blog makes sense and as we get closer to these end time events the details become clearer and clearer. God does not change but our understanding grows as events come ever closer.

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

Barry, Thanks for your reply!

I have heard of that position but disagree with it. True God gave Enoch a glimpse into what would be but he has no affiliation with Israel and he lived in the pre flood world. To different worlds. Moses and Elijah dealt with Israel’s rebellion and unbelief and they are Jews. These two witnesses will preach repentance and prepare Israel and the world for Messiah’s return and 1000 year reign, reestablish the sacrifice and offerings which we touched on in the post (Rev. 11:3-6, Moses Ex 23-40), which also will point back to the Person and work of Messiah and protect Israel from the world’s hatred and hostility for 3/12 years (Rev. 11:4-7).

Later the anti Christ will profane and desolate the sanctuary which God has reinstituted by Moses and murder them (Dan. 9:27,12:11, Matt 24:15, 2 Thess 2:4, Rev. 11:1-2). They also who are dead will be… resuscitated or raised from the dead and will ascend into heaven. It is very Jewish. The key to understanding Scripture is to think like a Jew my friend.

After the Rapture it will be a whole new dispensation and signs and wonder dominate this 7 year tribulation. We have to think Jewish to understand the day of the Lord and the kingdom age (Ezek 40-48, Zech 14 etc.)

The Lord Jesus, Lazarus, the man who Paul raised who fell of the balcony, Elijah’s widow’s son, the ruler of the synagogue’s young daughter, those at Christ resurrection etc... all died but were resuscitated and brought back to life so there are exceptions to the rule. Even the two witnesses and the anti Christ will come back from the dead as the Bible teaches Rev. 11:7-`5). Also when challenged by the Sadducees... Jesus stated that God is the God of the living not the dead.

Moses and Elijah were with Jesus on the mount of transfiguration.
The plagues and signs which they (the two witnesses will perform are identical to those that Moses and Elijah. And finally when you take Malachi 4 in context it talks about “the day” when Christ will purge the earth from all unsaved after His return. God’s final word to Israel for almost four hundred years is Remember Moses and Elijah. God knew that Israel would reject the kingdom offer by the Messiah and murder their King and Savior (Dan. 9:26) thus the church age for 2000 years, the rapture and then the day of the Lord. Be sure to check out Dr. Whitcomb"s audio message on this topic.

Thanks for your reply sorry for the long rant but just wanted to clarify my position on this.

As you know my friend, we are never to limit God and what He is doing

David

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

Amen Elizabeth!!

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

Dear friend, we will have to disagree on this. What I like is the feed back from many that help challenge this position. It only strengthens my position on this. God has protected their identity until the end. It is very clear to me that it is Elijah and Moses and the time coming up very shortly will be the most supernatural time of all times... The re-institution of the temple is what is key! for that will be the heart of the war in the 7 year trib (Daniel 9:27,12:11, Rev, 13, 2 Thess. 2:3-12, Matt 24:15

Thanks for your reply!
David

Anonymous said...

Just a thought. Could it be possible that the purpose of the two witnesses during the time of their stay in Jerusalem may be to focus the attention of the nations as well as the Jews on their proclamation that Jesus is the Messiah? If that is the case, then why would they encourage the rebuilding of the Temple and the re-institution of the Jewish sacrifices? I wonder if the reason God has chosen to place these two witnesses in the heart of Jerusalem during this first 3 and 1/2 years of the 7 year time period is to counter the intent of the Jews to do the very thing they are attempting to do, which is to again refuse the notion that Jesus is the true sacrifice and that no other sacrifice is needed or warranted by God the Father. Indeed it will be the intent of not only the Jews to rid their nation of words of these two witnesses, but the same desire will be had by the nations of the world who also oppose the words of these two men, atheists, liberal "Christians" and all others who choose to reject the Truth. Could that be the reason that they are protected from anyone who would attempt to kill them until their mission is complete? Remember the whole world will be watching and celebrating as these two lay in dead on the street for 3 and a half days before they are taken up into heaven.

Anonymous said...

"It is very clear to me that it is Elijah and Moses."

What about Elijah's other God-assigned task? He will be coming to the Jews to reunite the families.

Mal 4:5-6

"Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse."

This is why the Jews leave an empty chair for him at the seder table. The Jews will know who he is. The great and dreadful day of the Lord IS the tribulation, so I think Elijah is going to be unavailable to be one of the two witnesses.

It is more feasible to think that God is going to chose two unknown Jews to be His candlesticks. They will not be recognized but indeed will be one of the three instruments that God uses to bring His people to recognize the Jesus is the Messiah. The other two instruments are the 144,000 witnesses and the angel in Revelation that is giving the final call.

Good to chat with you. At some point, we will know! Right now, we can only try to interpret what God has said. He has His reasons for keeping some things unknown.

Barry Seal said...

Greetings, I Thought priests instituted Temple worship not prophets? Barry

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

Barry, thanks for you reply!

Who did God you to start the Leviticus order and who did Almighty God use to give the law and ordnances? And was not he a prophet?

David


Barry said...

David, It was Aaron and his sons that started the Levitical priesthood (Exodus 28:1-3),not Moses.
Barry

Barry Seal said...

David, I don't believe the Two Witnesses will have anything to do with the Temple at all, thus the absents of scripture on the subject. Why would they condone such practice knowing that Temple worship is wrong at this time due to the fact that the Jews don't believe that Jesus is the Messiah.

Barry

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

Barry, Thanks for your replies! Sorry for my late response.

Through Moses was the Leviticus priesthood and system established (Ex. 40). He was God's vessel.

This is tricky but not hard to see when we let the Holy Scriptures set the stage. The temple, offerings, priesthood etc... will be in practice before the beast desecrates the most holy place (Dan. 9:27. Matt. 24:15, Rev. 11:1-2, 2 Thess. 2:3-12). Also the tribulation is all about the Jew and God dealing with them as a people and a nation. It is a call to repentance to the nation (dresses in sackcloth) by the Two Witnesses and the offerings etc... will all point to Messiah's Person and work (Isa. 53, Psalm 110:1, Zech. 3-4). That is why Satan and the anti Christ will go after it to make it desolate (Dan. 9:27, 12:11, Matt 24:15, 2 Thess. 2:3-12).

This position has many new takers and not too many.... If you disagree with it that is fine but the key to seeing this time is through the eyes of the Jew and the Two Witnesses who's ministry dominates the first half of the seven year trib period. Moses and Elijah are the Two Witnesses as we have pointed out on this post. God has protected their identity until these last days... by connecting the dots we can clearly see it is none other.

After the rapture, the 144,000 and a remnant will come to the Messiah by these Two and after their murder and accession they will spread the Glorious Gospel of the risen Messiah throughout the entire world until Messiah returns(Matt 24:14, Rev. 7, 14:1-5)!


Thanks Barry!

Eph. 3:20-21!

David





Anonymous said...

GOD isn't going to just kill ENOCH. No GOD is sending back ENOCH and ELIJAH. Moses is already dead. You people of so called Christians really need to understand your BIBLES better.

Anonymous said...

the two witnesses started witnessing about Christ long before his birth and continue to this very day for they read year in and year out. Jesus in his parable about the rich man and Lazarus tells us exactly who these two witnesses were. in fact he even told Clopas and his traveling companion how these two witnesses were always pointing to him when Luke tells us that he began with the law and the prophets to tells them what was written about him. Abraham told the rich man in torment that his brothers had the law and the prophets and they should listen to them, but if they did not even a man rising from the dead would not convince them. John in his gospel tells us that the scribes and pharisees wanted to even put Lazarus to death for the people were started following
Christ on the fact that Lazarus died and was living.

Gary said...

I believe you are correct in your statement of the two witnesses being place in the first half of the seven year tribulation. However, consider that these two men have been given supernatural power and defensive capabilities by God during their time of preaching in the heart of Jerusalem. And it is God who calls them back to life after they have been slain and their dead bodies have lain in the streets of Jerusalem for three days. Why would they need to be given supernatural defense against anyone who would seek to harm them if they are attempting to promote the reestablishment of the temple including the daily sacrifice?

Perhaps the reason they have been placed there in the heart of Jerusalem while the Jewish people are indeed attempting to rebuild the temple is to offer God's truth about Jesus being the ultimate sacrifice and there being no need to attempt to re-institute this past Jewish rite. If these two witnesses were in favor of rebuilding the temple, would they be promoting a blasphemous act that is contrary to the purpose and will of the Father in heaven for both the Jew and the Gentile alike?

Could it be that the reason the whole world, including the Jews in all Israel, would celebrate the death of these two witnesses is because of their promoting Jesus as the only true sacrifice and that the body of Christ, i.e., all who truly believe in Jesus as the true Messiah are the true temple of God. These two witnesses would then be preaching this truth to the Jews in the very heart of Jerusalem, while the Jews are clearly rejecting the sacrifice of Jesus by the very act of attempting to rebuild that previously destroyed temple.

Regarding the temple, Jesus did what He said He would do in John 2:18-22 (NASB):

The Jews then said to Him, “What sign do You show us as your authority for doing these things?” Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.” The Jews then said, “It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?” But He was speaking of the temple of His body. So when He was raised from the dead, His disciples remembered that He said this; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had spoken.

And with regard to what is the true temple, we have the words of Paul in 1 Corinthians 3:9-17 (NASB) :

For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, God’s building..... Do you not know that you are a temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.

And finally we have the "rapture" of these two witnesses being caught up into heaven on the third day after they were slain. This is done in the midst of the whole world celebrating their death and indeed the world will be astounded to see this miracle of God confirming the very message of these two witnesses that Jesus is the true Messiah and that the rebuilding of another temple by the Jews is futile.

Just offering some thoughts to consider.

Sincerely,

Gary

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

Gary, thanks for your thoughts for there are many from people on this topic. will consider all.

David

organicnaturals said...

Hi, and blessings to you..

About The Two Witnesses

And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth. And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed. These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will. (Rev. 11:3-6 KJV)

I believe there is no need to look any further and add to the scripture when the scripture confirms that the two witnesses "are the two annointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth" as confirmed by God's prophet Zechariah 4:1-3,11-14 KJV

And the angel that talked with me [Zechariah] came again, and waked me, as a man that is wakened out of his sleep, And said unto me, What seest thou? And I said, I have looked, and behold a candlestick all of gold, with a bowl upon the top of it, and his seven lamps thereon, and seven pipes to the seven lamps, which are upon the top thereof: And two olive trees by it, one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof. . . . Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?

And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves? And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord. Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth. (Zech. 4:1-3, 11-14 KJV)

Any reputable concordance can be used to discern what the candlestick of gold pipes to the seven lamps.... and the two olive branches.... represent, which are not Elijah & Moses. I would publish it here, but the literature goes indepth in its explanation.

The Ignorant Fishermen said...

Thanks my friend, I totally disagree with your position but these are the things will reveal to us at His coming.

As I have shared I do believe them to be Moses and Elijah

Thanks for your reply!

David

quinton said...

The two witnesses do not do good in the west , they beling in Israel, Its the closest to home which is heaven. Fire proceedes out of there mouth that is blue flame, from heaven . It destroys impurity if anyone fights against it theyll die. Thats what it took to get them pure and they use the same flame on there enemy's to reveal them as that. The two witnesses are also nuts , the world would make them completley insane , they don't fit in in the world .

quinton said...

temperature. However, the blue flame found in soot-free flames result from electrons jumping among energy states in either oxygen or carbon dioxide.

The fire from the two witnesses are
blue flames. They are not movie stars.

quinton said...

Excuse me I could be wrong I am not a phycisit, nor do I think that physics can explain the totality of Gods Kingdom or compare at all. It could actually come out red at times , while I do think that physics help is to understand some things and I dont think that it is wrong to talk about at times Gods word is omnipotent and he created everything by the word of his mouth so there is no challenger.

quinton said...

And it actually is fire from heaven , remember the kingdom of heaven is within. Luke 17:20-21

quinton said...

Its within them and around them , so the external world is also within them and when its corrupted it tries to corrupt them within so they call fire out onto whats within. Luke 17:20-21 . The eye gate before it klimgs to them psalms 101:3

quinton said...

Now lets go to Rev. 11:5 the end of the verse.

If anyone should try to harm them, in this manner he will be killed.

It says "In this manner ". Are they talking about the manner of fire? Or during this manner as in if anyone should harm them in this fashion? Go to the Hebrew word Demuth. Means concretley, model , shape, adverbally , like . Another definition . Hebrew word Dibrah feminine, Cause, meaning , MANNER. It would be like a killer stalking you for witnessing.

I would in the third temple everyones accepted no matyer what you do as long as you make an offering for sin Im noting to the liberalness of Israel at the time , and Israel not straying to familiar spirits and witches and psychics and warlords , Id say the two have time to minister Gods word in truth and spirit with bodyguards by the militaty. Jesus had Peter who cut a guards ear off. With the increasing tensions in the world that flame comes out high resolute.

quinton said...

But then again you have to think how do they get overtaken if they have backup? That would mean when the beast makes war on them he disarms there firepower?
Secondly the rapture takes place first they get left behind and killed?
Id say the beast disarms the military somehow thats how he gets into the third temple.

quinton said...

Guns dont really sit well with me on the subject so I would say thats not enough faith. The bible says that thou shall not kill and anyone who lives by the sword must die by it. Exodus 20:13 Mathew 26:52. Guns seem too rot. Pro erbs 25:11

quinton said...

Angels with guns No. Too worldly because God destroyed sodom and Gammorah with fire and brimstone , to put guns into would undermine his authority especially at such a time and is blasphemous even I think.

quinton said...

I dont think Gods two witnesses can touch any kind of firearm.

quinton said...

I believe that Gids two witnesses are two witnesses that git wronged in this worls because they are not of this world , God said tonthe evil men dont touch my children. And they get to be qhonGod the creators of the heavens and the earth made them to be. Gen. 1:1. God formed there flesh from the dust but with Christ death and there salvation he said Im going to put my two right here in the heavens , this is where they come from. The word comes from Gods throne , they have a saphire throne though , this is Christ throne as well, this is 1 of the 12 thrones . Mathew 19:28 . Jesus's throne is the greatest. He embeded Mt. Tzion in there hearts. Psalms 125:1

quinton said...

hese two prophets are the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the Lord of all the earth. 5If anyone tries to harm them, fire flashes from their mouths and consumes their enemies. This is how anyone who tries to harm them must die. Rev 11: 1-4.

This is the NLT all glory to God .

quinton said...

The hebrew word is Hephek ; Contrary. If anyone should harm them in this manner he shall be killed. The bible tells us in Gods word that the soul who sineth shall die. Ezekiel 18:20 this is from Mt. Sinai. From the law of Moshe given by God. But now, all you who light fires and provide yourselves with flaming torches, go, walk in the light of your fires and of the torches you have set ablaze. This is what you shall receive from my hand: You will lie down in torment. Isaiah 50:11 Now reverse the curse to Mt. Tzion which is the new testament, the curse would be to lie down in torment , the two witnesses will lie down in peace. The Mishne Torah talks about soot from a kindled flame , psalms 104:4 He makes winds his messengers , his servants a flame of fire. Psalms 104:4 Yet their voice goes out into all the earth, their words to the ends of the world. In the heavens God has pitched a tent for the sun. Psalms 19:4 . Gods word is hotter than the sun , his word is so hot that he gives the sun a rest.